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Cul-de-sac

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Post  elwood-59 Thu 25 Apr 2019, 7:09 pm

Hi,

Seems like I run into a cul-de-sac.
Got my tender back from painting and was preparing some sub-assemblies to put on after the tender is mounted. Currently I try to fit the RH wheel to the RH drive casting BS42350. I can fit both onto the axle, tight but still ok. I fitted the two keys to connect drive casting to axle.

But whatever I do, I seem not to be able to put the two drive lugs on RH wheel into the recesses of drive casting while on the axle. Off the axle it mounts (fairly) good but cannot get the axle in, then. Tried to feel for a step between casting and wheel when both are assembled, but cannot feel one. Still it seems as if the axle is locking up when entering the gap between drive casting and axle.

I hesitate to open up the two holes in drive casting as this might lead to play in drive. Would not want to open up the hole in either the wheel or the drive casting for same reason.

Any idea? How did it work with your build? Or do I miss something? I am at a point where I muse about banging all together but the I‘d have to fit the axle plus wheel as one - not so easy and what about removing it next time? I‘d prefer not to go this way.

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Mark the spark Thu 25 Apr 2019, 7:23 pm

I had the same problem and I just turned a few thou off the drive pins till I got a snug fit

Mark the spark

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Post  lynnr Thu 25 Apr 2019, 8:02 pm

Take the inner hub plate with the pins of the wheel if you can. check the pins into the drive flange casting and fit as required.
A little off the pins is not a problem as you will find it is on a particular side.

By doing the pins. If you really get in to trouble. A couple new pins is not an issue.
lynnr
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Post  elwood-59 Thu 25 Apr 2019, 9:06 pm

Hi,

Mark: I already went this way by carefully removing some material with abrasive paper so right now pins are a press-fit (by hand!).
And Lynn, yes in hindsight I should have checked position and orientation of pins with the hub plate of RH hub still off, but I trusted the fit. Guess I cannot take the cover off anymore, as it‘s already epoxied it (about a year ago), so no chance to remove the hub plate. Would have done if still possible.

So all in all I will continue with other side (differential) and come back later to that, thinking about which way to go now.


Thanks

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Mark the spark Thu 25 Apr 2019, 9:11 pm

Hi Elwood
I did it on my lathe I took off about 5 thou at a time and test fitted each time until I got a nice fit

Mark the spark

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Post  elwood-59 Thu 25 Apr 2019, 10:31 pm

Hi Mark,

Would do but the wheel does not fit the lathe - which I do not have anyways. The pins are already fixed to the hub plate and this in turn is epoxied to the hub. Don‘t think I can easily take the hub apart to get down to the pins. Will have to continue to work with elbow grease Shocked

Thanks just the same

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Mark the spark Thu 25 Apr 2019, 10:40 pm

AHH
I did mine before I did the final assembly on the wheels

Mark the spark

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Post  elwood-59 Thu 25 Apr 2019, 10:41 pm

Clever decision, but too late for me Embarassed
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Post  elwood-59 Fri 26 Apr 2019, 7:11 pm

Hi,

back from workshop aka garage.
fiddled 2h with drive casting wheel and axle, but still no progress What a Face
Tried to ease up pins as suggested above, the pins are now an easy (means sliding) fit to the drive casting, better than yesterday. When the casting is fitted to the wheel I can push in the axle until it‘s about a inch into the wheel, not further.
If I simulate the assembly by fitting drive casting to axle and then slide on wheel the pins touch the holes in drive casting but will not lock, I tried to see where they touch but had no luck so far.

Been thinking to day on how to disassemble wheel to sort out as suggested by Lynn but just see no way to do so without damaging the whole wheel. And I don‘t want to buy another one just to sort out the two pins affraid

Any sggestion very much appreciated.

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  lynnr Fri 26 Apr 2019, 7:15 pm

Engineers blue or "dyecam"
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Post  elwood-59 Fri 26 Apr 2019, 7:34 pm

Hi Lynn,

had none at hand so I used a felt pen, but could not find where the pin touches. Sad
Gave up for today.

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Mark the spark Fri 26 Apr 2019, 7:38 pm

If the axel is getting part way into the wheel it must be close. In your place I would use a cylinder hone to polish the wheel bore a wee bit at a time till the axel fits
Your only other option is to remover the wheel rear cover

Mark the spark

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Post  elwood-59 Fri 26 Apr 2019, 8:12 pm

Hi Mark,

been thinking down that line too, but would prefer not to touch the wheel bore to avoid a wobbly wheel. Right now the wheel runs great on the axle, but if I open up the bore this might change for the worse. Both casting and wheel run good on axle with no play so I tend to get the pins to fit into the casting by „manipulating“ the pins to a certain point.

As for removing the rear cover no idea how to do Question  

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Simon C Fri 26 Apr 2019, 8:57 pm

Hi Elwood
I had the same problem with the drive side wheel as Mark and you.
On my engine the problem was a misalignment of the inner wheel cover to the centre of the hub.
The misalignment was so small that I could hardly feel it until running a fingernail over it.
I eased the bore in the back plate to get my wheel on and engaged.
My wheel got very stuck at one point and I could not get it back off the axle frustration being the main cause along with some bruit force and ignorance.
My moment of look came when I got 2 countersunk screws out of the front plate that are opposite each other, this enabled me to attach a puller to the wheel and get it back off.
It took surprisingly little force to pull it off considering it had resisted all other attempts to remove it.
Simon
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Post  Mark the spark Sat 27 Apr 2019, 10:34 am

Hi Elwood
A cylinder hone is a very slow way of removing material it would take a couple of minutes to remove even one thou of material . so if you checked the wheel every minute or so I dout very much you would notice any wobble
Start from where the axel stops in the wheel hub and work your way out and don't forget to use plenty lub

Mark the spark

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Post  elwood-59 Sat 27 Apr 2019, 6:01 pm

Hi all,

Thanks for all the ideas.

After a long sleepless night and many thoughts I came up with a different plan. I fixed the axle to my workbench with some pipe clamps and fitted the wheel to it - inside out - so I could put the drive casting on much as I will do when mounting the wheel.

First I checked where the pins bind, I put a small strip of paper (off a newspaper) between pin and hole and with gentle pulling I found where the pin touches.

With a lot of fiddling, emery paper and elbow grease I got the pins to fit deeper and deeper into the casting. Now I can push the casting on the axle onto the pins by hand up to the last 2 mm. For the rest I can use a soft hammer - set. In that constellation I can still turn wheel and casting on axle, so no binding (anymore). Puahhh.bounce

So back to fitting the tender, differential and second shaft, and finally the wheels.

Thanks again

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Mark the spark Sat 27 Apr 2019, 6:22 pm

Well done
It might help to know that I cover my axels and diff assembly in copper grease everytime they are off so they don't stick

Mark the spark

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Post  elwood-59 Sat 27 Apr 2019, 6:26 pm

Hi Mark,

If you ever tried to remove your car wheels after a long -i.e. salty winter you know you better do so to ease removal of wheels next time. Steel rims and hubs seem to stick very well.

Cheers

Elwood
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Post  Capricorn1 Tue 30 Apr 2019, 1:26 pm

Remember the right hand or off-side wheel does not revolve on the axle as it is driven by the drive hub which is keyed in place and should be a good firm if not tight fit. And you will find that after a degree of use anything not firmly fitted in place will come loose and eventually start giving you problems.

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Post  elwood-59 Tue 30 Apr 2019, 1:55 pm

Hi Capricorn,

Thanks for the remark. And, yes, I know the RH wheel is not meant to turn on the axle, but to be „locked“ onto it by the drive casting. The issue I had was misalingment between casting and wheel by the pins not protruding correctly into the casting. This is  taken care of now, the three parts: axle, wheel and drive casting now are fine in relation to each other.
As you stated that anything that has just a bit of „looseness“ will get worse with wear and use. Therefore I wanted to put as litte additional „play“ into the fitting. But it still needs to be able to be takena part, if need might be. So a sliding fit was whar I was aiming for with borderline to press fit.
Now the wheel can be fitted to the axle but with some hand force, it is far from a running or loose fit. I made sure of that! It‘s just to a point where I do not need a hammer (yet) to fit the wheel Very Happy

Hope this explains it in more depth and sorry if my expanation above was a bit misleading.

Cheers

Elwood
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